Tal Stone
Last Thursday I found myself walking towards the bright lights of the Sydney’s All Phones Arena at Homebush. Turning the corner, I realised I was in the right place when I saw a line that would have done any night club proud – dozens of attractive young women in full hair and heavy make-up, long tanned legs bared in defiance of the winter chill, eagerly waiting their turn.
I took my place at the end of the line. Like all the women here on this cold night, I had come to try out for the Lingerie Football League (LFL). Though my motives were a little different. I wanted to see how we would be treated, what would be required of us, and to test the notion that this was real sport.
I was handed an application form, talent release and ‘Waiver of Compensation’ form. The last informed us that the League would not be liable if we were injured. Was that even legal? I saw one of the American players on crutches and wondered how she was paying for her treatment.
The girl in front of me offered me her pen, and helped me figure out the entry process. She told me that she was a surfer, did athletics, and had brought her father along as her support. There were many men in the stands, male friends and some other fathers.
With the paperwork out of the way, we made our way through to the change rooms. The girls in front of me had already started stripping down to their tryout clothes, none as extreme as the lingerie we would be expected to wear if we got through.
We each had a number written on our arms that would become “Your Name” on field – failure to respond to this number meant running a lap of the field, and a repeat of this offense would see us cut from the group, with no chance of selection. A girl ahead of me received number ‘69’, an honour which saw the US LFL team members cheering and joking that this girl had just received a free ticket through to the final selection. Every time number 69 was up, any athleticism or skill she displayed was overlooked in favour of continuing the joke that a numerical reference to oral sex was all the proof she needed of her potential.
We entered the floodlit arena to find it transformed into an astroturfed miniature gridiron field. I nervously made my way down to the field, where a large group of about 80 milled around waiting. Amongst this group were a handful of obviously serious athletes. I later discovered that one LFL hopeful was already a part of a semi-professional women’s football league, and another had represented Australia in baseball.
We were put into numerical order for the first drill. Along the sidelines were a number of US LFL players in red tracksuits. They walked around demonstrating drills and pumping the girls up through the night.
LFL founder Mitch Mortaza introduced himself and some of the star players. We then commenced with a warm up before three hours of drills as Mortaza patrolled with a clipboard, looking us up and down, watching our moves.
A cameramen appeared, lying on the ground taking upward angle shots of us running past. I was very thankful to be wearing long tights. I felt less exposed than some of the other women. I wondered how the photos would be used and where.
It wasn’t long before the music pumped up and the LFL players surrounded us, firing us up, urging us to be aggressive to each other. They then went on to insult us, screaming “You’re a pussy!” followed by a hand gesture in the shape of a vagina. As well as acting as an insult, the vagina hand shape was also later held above the heads of the top 20 as a victory sign.
We were shown the drill once and then expected to be able to mimic it. If we failed to do so we were screamed at, called a pussy and then Mortaza would yell “Stop wasting my fucking time, if you are here to fucking sight see, get the fuck out!” The way he spoke to us, made us feel like what we had to offer was never good enough.
Along with being ruthless he also showed a lack of knowledge of the sport. Mortaza made a fool of himself as he attempted to demonstrate a simple drill, leaving players confused as to what signal he was trying to communicate.
One drill was girl against girl. If we didn’t fight with all we had, we would be pushed to the ground, but that wasn’t good enough for Mortaza. He didn’t just want us to wrestle the girl he wanted us to “pancake the shit out of her”. The girl that ended up getting smashed to the ground was laughed at and along with the hand gesture, was called a pussy by all the LFL players.
During this drill, other LFL players shouted “own her” and “put her in the parking lot” and “haul your arse”. We were expected to physically hurt our opponent. I think this is what disturbed me most. It wasn’t about playing football, it was about how aggressively we could act towards the other girls, how much pain we could inflict, all to entertain the crowd.
For most of the girls this was the first time they had encountered American-style football, playing a sport that isn’t actually Australian. Yet we received incredibly harsh criticism when we failed to match the skills shown by the LFL players who were professional players.
One of the girls I became friends with was behind me and I expressed my concern at the uniform we would be required to wear if we were chosen. She seemed oblivious as to as why this would be a concern. The tall blonde went on to be selected for the top 20, despite lacking the skill, speed and strength of other hopefuls.
After the drills we were then asked to gather around and hear two stories of ‘inspiration’ from two of the most popular LFL players. One story was not give up if you didn’t make it through, the other was to give us insight into what life was like in the LFL. LFL All Star Liz Gorman joked about it being the “fat story” as she had to lose weight when she was picked for the team. (I had already read that players who gained weight were humiliated). ”It is it about image,” she said. She also made a comment about the uniform,“The uniform it is was it is”. We were also warned about the amount of criticism we would receive from being a LFL player and that people would be harsh about our appearance so we had to look after our bodies.
Mortaza then read out the numbers of the girls who were chosen for the final round. Despite my ability to perform the drills, it was clear Mortaza wanted a certain ‘look’. So I was not particularly surprised that a number of us who had displayed greater football skills remained on the sidelines.
While a couple of the girls who made the cut were obviously talented athletes, in the end it was clear to everyone that our ability to play gridiron was a far lower priority than how our body would fill out the uniform.
The night ended with a pep talk about how to look sexy on Saturday night when those selected for a Sydney team to play competitively in December 2013 would be presented during half time at tonight’s LFL game in Sydney. They had to make sure hair and make-up was done and they were showing themselves as sexy, hot girls who had had a lot to offer – on or off the field.
A number of us worked hard and I’m still recovering. We faced constant belittlement and abuse. But our form wasn’t important if we weren’t stereotypically hot.
I’d love to be able to play gridiron someday. I love to test my body and mind to the limits of endurance. But I want to play a game where we are respected and valued for our abilities on the field. I want to know that our clubs would take care of us in terms of salary and insurance. I don’t want to play some pseudo sport where we are expected to wear sexy underwear and engage in girl-on-girl violence, and be called pussies, because that’s what we have been reduced to in a strip show style spectacle for the gratification of men, under the guise of sport.
Tal Stone is a 23 year-old Sydney university student and athlete.
See also: ‘Divers in speedos, Warwick Capper’s footy shorts, wrestling: the stunning arguments in defence of lingerie football’, MTR
‘When women are sport: lingerie football comes to Australia’, MTR
‘Meet lingerie author’, Kerri Sackville
‘Lingerie Football League: what it’s really about and do we want it in Australia?’ xyonline
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49 Responses
some is sour they did got picked.
i played rugby league my whole life and was yelled at every training sessions. harden the fuck up. if someone is not good enough they shouldn’t complain.
Absolutely gobsmacked that this degrading crap is allowed – especially being promoted as a family event. It should be banned. Why is it in this so called politically correct culture that women can still be demeaned and humiliated this way? Why do women allow themselves to be subject to this rubbish? We are not teaching our girls dignity or self respect. This is just public pornography. God help us!
Well done Tal! Trying out for LFL took guts, and your story proves what many have suspected all along about abusive and exploitative practices in the league.
Seriously Jones? You’ve totally missed the point. Tal does not want a place on the team, she went to the try outs to expose their shonky tactics. She’s certainly confirmed every other report we’ve read about the LFL’s founder.
Jones, when you played Rugby League, did your coach organise for you to pose for Playboy and then pocket 80% of the model fee? Apparently that’s what Mitch Mortaza did to the US players. He got $10000 per woman, then gave them $2000 each. I wonder if he has the same plans for the women that tried out on Thursday night?
http://clevelandsports360.com/wordpress/the-nfl-the-nba-has-one-why-not-the-lingerie-football-league/
I found it difficult to read this. I admire the author for going to the tryout and writing about it but knowing that there were so many girls there who didn’t think anything was wrong with they way they were treated or what was expected of them is so upsetting.
It did take guts to try out Tal and I’m sure some people now have a better understanding about what is involved in Lingerie football league. But that’s exactly what it is ‘Lingerie’. The women who make it and play the game week to week are quite happy to objectify themselves and anybody who agrees to run onto a field in a skimpy outfit covered in make up and fake tan are objectifying themselves well before they allow a male population to do the same.
I also think that female athletes deserve the same respect as all athletes but as far as I can see LFL is not a real sport, nor is it played by real athletes. The male comparison would be, a talented stage dancer fighting for respect as a performer whilst on stage with manpower.
Hi Tal,
Thanks for writing this article! It is so good to get a better “inside” understanding of what this whole thing is on about considering its causing so much tension.
We want to be known for our sporting abilities and gifts, strong athletic beautiful bodies ARE a gift….but If woman think this is “liberating” them and making them “equal” and showing “They can do it too” they have been misguided. This simply makes woman a “sex object” again, like we havent been that for most of history!
We as woman are worth so much more.
We make her paint her face and dance
If she won’t be a slave, we say that she don’t love us
If she’s real, we say she’s trying to be a man
While putting her down, we pretend that she’s above us
from:
Woman is the N….r of the World (John and Yoko Lennon), 1972
40 years later?
Thank you Tal for adding to our information on this so-called sport by your first-hand experience and account. It is so important that the public knows accurately what it is opposing or supporting in our society. Hopefully public porn like this ‘family entertainment’ will be able to be legislated against soon.
I’m not sure ‘Jones’quite got the point of this post.
I actually don’t have a great deal to say, really except I found myself shaking my head at various points throughout Tal’s story. I cannot even believe that this level of degradation is accepted as entirely normal and appropriate – it really is not! Society is just getting worse, it appears.
What I’m flabbergasted at (but not surprised by) is the combination of signing a “Waiver of Compensation” combined with the repeated encouragement to hurt your opponent.
Gridiron is one of the most heavily armoured sports out there, for good reason.
No serious male athlete would sign up for an Underpants Football League.
I commend you on your stance and actions Tal! As an alumnus, ex-athlete and ex-academic of the University of Sydney I am proud to see exceptional people like you step up for a cause.
Quite clearly this issue is not about being “not good enough,” but about disrespecting and degrading the innate and societal value of women. That is what LFL and its proponents are working towards, whether they realise it or not.
Well done for trying out Tal – fascinating commentary on the inside workings of the LFL tryouts. Your article sparked off a couple of thoughts, so I’ve been wandering around the net for a bit today, having a look at how Australian sporting codes organise themselves, and have come up with some interesting findings. If you go to ausport.gov.au and playbytherules.net.au you can find the steps that sporting organisations should take to ensure that they are governed and operated appropriately under Australian law.
Interestingly, they are meant to have member protection policies, and codes of behaviour. They are also meant to have policies that prevent sexual harrassment and discrimination.
After reading a bit, I took a little google walk through various Australian sporting organisations, (just putting things like AFL code of conduct/NRL code of conduct/Australian basketball code of conduct into Google) and found that they all have Codes of Conduct (even if they’re not adhered to completely!) When I popped LFL or Lingerie Football League code of conduct into Google, I was unable to come up wtih anything at all. Interestingly it was easy to find the US’s NFL code of conduct.
After reading the Sex Discrimination/Harrassment Fact sheet from playbytherules.net.au it would seem that the LFL tryouts have at the very minimum, pushed the boundaries into harrassment – actually they’ve possibly jumped well over the boundary – just by making comments about number 69 athlete.
“Behaviour such as unwanted sexual comments or abuse, unwanted sexual suggestions, offensive gestures and unwanted sexual contact can be interpreted as sexual harassment.” (From the Fact sheet) and apparently the law about sexual harrassment says “… in circumstances in which a reasonable person, having regard to all the circumstances, would have anticipated that the person harassed would be offended, humiliated or intimidated.”” This is all without even alluding to the lingerie worn as “uniforms” or the behaviour described on Collective Shout’s Tweets last night. I’m no lawyer, but I’d be interested to hear what a professional would say about Tal’s experience at the tryouts, not to mention the injury waiver (I’m a health professional who works with injured sports people amongst others, and most local clubs have insurance policies that at least cover athletes that play intertown games) or the behaviour at last night’s game.
You went into the tryout with no real intention to compete and obviously no prior experience in a high contact sport. Stop trying to pass this off as legitimate investigative journalism, and stick to whatever other feminist issues are a hot topic. Yes these women are being objectified and I’m not going to enter the debate as to whether it is classified as sport. Nonetheless, it is typical US style entertainment that obviously has a market out here. If they want to play hardball at tryouts, they obviously take it more seriously than spectators think.
Harden up.
Great work Tal! This is a really important insider’s view.
I noticed from the Collective Shout tweeting photos that there wasn’t a very big crowd. I find it very hard to believe that this sort of ‘entertainment’ will gain much popularity…. and sincerely hope that it doesn’t.
I feel like there’s too much criticism directed towards the women who ‘objectify themselves’, when we should be directing our criticism at the culture that encourages that. If women are rewarded when they are ‘hot’, it is not entirely surprising that some choose to buy into it. A cultural shift whereby a woman’s worth is not tied to her appearance and sexual availability is needed.
If people call this degrading they clearly have a boring, pointless life and have nothing better to do than complain about the fact that they dont have the body, confidence and passion that these LFL players clearly exhibit. If the sport is so degrading, why do women line up to play? They had the choice and were not forced into try outs by a ‘pimp’ etc. These players wear just as much clothing as many track and field athletes in the olympics, are paid well and really seem to enjoy the experience. Sure, there will be low lifes and even pervertes at games watching- this is a down side, but i’m sure that this is the case for all sports.
If your not a fan of it you don’t have to watch but don’t complain about something that many of these athletes clearly enjoy. You only had to watch the girls celebrating the victory and enjoying the feeling of success with a team of like minded individuals./
I hope this sport gets bigger
Poor dear Tal. Heavens above, don’t tell me you had no idea what to expect. I mean, haven’t you seen the LFL prior to attending the tryout. You obviously went to tryout like everyone else. But guess what princess, you didn’t make it. Let’s get real here, it is simply a case of sour grapes with you, you just weren’t good enough on all levels?
Wow, Anonymous, nice courage putting your name up.
Why are these women lining up? Because they’ve been CONDITIONED to by the porn culture that’s now become ‘trendy’. At this rate we can just do away with Disney movies, we can just jump straight to teaching our daughters to get to those pole dancing lessons on time.
There’s NOTHING wrong with the sport itself and lots of those women want the challenge to extend their physical selves and feel wonderful.
But the MOMENT the word ‘lingerie’ is in its title – it’s exploitation.
So, back to the ‘it’s their choice’ argument (which is so flimsy), I ask you this – what would happen if you put a child in a room full of lollies and chocolate? They would eat until they made themselves sick. It was their choice though.
OK, so they’re JUST kids, you say. Well, teen girls as young as 12 are sexting their genitals to boys. Their choice. Why are they doing this? Because the trendy porn culture is telling them to – something the LFL will only perpetuate.
So now we have women being watched ONLY because they’re in their underwear (becasue it has NOTHING to do with the sport) and it’s SEXUAL. The Olympics is not. (Lame comparison, btw)
We women are quite an insecure bunch (consumerism needs us to be), so yes, there will ALWAYS be women lining up to partake in such things – but does it make it RIGHT?
Is making money, at whatever cost, the only thing that’s respected in this world? Well, in America it is and that’s why they’re in the shit. Do we REALLY want this in Australia?
Men have to get over themselves and man up – watch your porn at home – don’t splash it around on our everyday screens breeding an army of hyper-sexualised women.
Start being men and stop being boys.
Critic,
how do you know Tal went with no intention to compete? She played hard but never had the chance to make the choice about going to to the next round, because the LFL were never looking to prioritise talent of the athletic variety.
Family entertainment they call it, is taking a child to watch women in next to nothing running around trying to rip another women’s clothing of, smashing into them to harm them as much as possible really “Family Entertainment”. What are our children going to grow up thinking, it is ok then to rip a women’s clothing of force her to the ground and please themselves with her. That is where society is heading today. If you don’t believe me then read the papers, look online. This so called game is nothing but selling soft porn as far as I can see. All of you who say there is nothing wrong with the “Game” and toughen up need to have a really good think about that. I will not be going to any of these games as I enjoy real sport.
Toughen up princess. What did u expect? If u take the sex appeal out of it, how do u think a foreign sport could generate any sort of interest in Oz? I saw it on Saturday night and was impressed. There were tough women out there who obviously knew how to play the game. It’s not a sport for the faint hearted (like yourself).
The outfits weren’t that revealing, especially with the big shoulder pads and helmets that they wear. Have u ever seen beach volleyball? Are their outfits ok? Does that use sex appeal to generate interest?
To have a national league you need to have some revenue. Flying teams around the country takes money. American football is an aggressive sport. Oh yeah, there was quite a few women spectators as well.
you, just completely missed the point paul and various others. read again. first two paragraphs if you will.
I know already that this is not a sport but only a way to made somebody pocket full, the game is only a clear cover up for a display of violence and sex.
Tal Stone had be brave to go trough that for exposing such bestiality.
Is a shame that the authority had allow this show of abuse and vulgarity to be welcome in Australia.
Mitch Mortaza is at level like of prostitution pimp and the police shall insure to investigate his pass and present record, that probably can incriminate him and also be refuse the visa as not gradita person.
Yeah few issues with this…
First…who is to say that the girls picked were chosen just because they were going to look better in uniform despite having lesser skills? You’d need a few people with some actual gridiron coaching knowledge to confirm that.
Mortaza might have described the drill fine and you just didnt understand it..did other girls find it hard? And on him saying not to waste his time, thats fair. You were only there to write this story right? If you were picked would you have joined the team? If not, then you were wasting the time of coaches and scouts there.
Sorry, but if critics want the LFL to be known for being just football, then its going to be like football. I agree with the top comment, in football if youre doing something not at 100% you’re going to get yelled at. It happens, and in football anywhere you’re going to be called names like ‘pussy’ if youre going soft.
Just a few things to say about this.
I also tried out on Thursday night. I went with the intention on making the team along with a heap of girls who I play gridiron with outside the LFL image. There is a growing ladies gridiron league in new south wales that is establishing teams all over sydney. They don’t play in lingerie. They have insurance. They have real coaches who are lovely to work with and the teams are filling up with girls who are trying to learn a new sport and everyone is welcome. At least 18 of the girls picked for LFL that night have been training with these teams for 6 months. I have been too but I was too skinny and lacked the strength for the LFL which is something I’m working on. I was very upset that I didn’t make the team and cried a lot. It was so hard to watch my own friends introduce LFL to sydney that saturday night. They all deserved it but because they had all worked harder than me. I had the skills .. I could catch and throw and Mitch asked to see my skills twice on the night. I’m recovered now and still going to try next time. Until then, I’m going to keep playing normal gridiron and learn new skills and get to the gym. If you want to play normal gridiron in uniforms, against teams, with insurance, let me know. The girls that got picked are all on these teams and we all joined them before we knew about the LFL trials. We went along to have fun knowing some might make it and some might not. I’m proud of all my friends who made it and hope they go well an that I’ll join them soon. My boyfriend and I both play normal gridiron on local teams and would love for more girls to play .. So let me know and I’ll give you some info. LFL isn’t the only way to play this beautiful sport.
You make a lot of assumptions in this article.
You assumed your athletic ability was greater than some of the women picked for the team. They could have been great at football, with certain athletic skill sets you just weren’t seeing. You said it yourself, Gridiron is not an Australian sport, do you really know every single role and responsibility of every position on the field? Perhaps the girls that were picked over you had slightly more pace, or had more strength to hold a defensive player off while the QB makes a pass. Who knows? Probably the LFL coaching staff, that’s who.
As for the shouting and belittlement, maybe that’s an inter-cultural communication issue. I’m no expert on American sporting culture, but maybe a consideration of how they treat ALL their athletes is necessary. Maybe all high-contact sports in the US use the same method of motivating and psyching up before competing, regardless of gender. They’re bringing their sport here, why would they change their methods for us?
I played rugby league at a competitive level for years, trash talk has always been part of that culture, so why wouldn’t it be present in a sport that you could argue is its US counter-part?
As for the skimpy costumes or “uniforms”, I don’t necessarily agree with it. My partner was considering playing, and the costumes were definitely a concern of hers as she has also played sport at a very high representative level. I can understand her concern completely. She also understands it’s part of the sport, and is taking that into consideration. As a business, the LFL have resorted to certain tactics in order to turn over a profit. One of those tactics happens to be the uniforms.
You may not like it, I may not like it, but traditionally women sports received little to no attention at all. Lingerie Football is now one of the worlds fastest growing sports. It may be due to a gimmick, one that a lot of us don’t agree with, but at the end of the day it’s a lucrative business. If you don’t like it, don’t play/watch it and let those with less inhibitions take part.
JOSH
R U KIDDING ME… IS THIS MITCHELL? i PLAYED IN NY AND LET ME TELL YOU MITCH IS THE BEST EVER IN MARKETING..HE IS A MARKETING GURU
U have no idea what you are talking about if this is not Mitch! I think being called a pussy is irrelevent! I dont agree wit that being a problem BUT This is 100% about looks and 10% about football. Let him do his thing just dont call it football..It is only a themed football event
I see there are some male commenters who are desperately trying to pick apart the writer’s experience. Ask yourselves why you are so defensive about a ‘sport’ where women play in minimal clothing for no pay? Whose interests are you really protecting?
Tal thanks for having the guts to go to the try outs and write this piece. I’m sure you know full well the kind of abuse women can be subjected to for calling out sexist and exploitative practices. Well done.
LFL defenders, is it so hard to comprehend? She strongly suspected the league of being dodgy so she went to confirm whether the rumors were accurate. She reported that players were subjected to verbal abuse, that mortaza knows little about the actual sport of gridiron and that those who were conventionally hot were selected over others regardless of sporting ability.
Mortaza himself has admitted this much- he said ‘You have to be able to market this sport’.
thank you to everyone who has taken the time to read about my experience at the LFL try-outs. I just want to respond to a few things.
Firstly the issue of the uniform in comparison to beach volley ball and track/field etc. those are not contact sports, they don’t require a helmet or any other protection for the body. And they do not expose cleavage or include frills and a garter. Gridiron is on of the most dangerous contact sports that results in hospitalization and serious life altering injuries. That’s why NFL players where the uniforms they do. Ask a NFL player to step out on a field in a helmet shoulder, knee and elbow pads and just his underwear and see how many would volunteer for that? Because these women according to Ex LFL player Deborah Poles are pretty much volunteering to put their life on the line every game because they don’t get paid or receive any compensation for any injuries they receive, pretty much Mitch is a pimp to the players of LFL. There is only one size uniform you either fit it or not, once you make the team you either need to put on weight or loose weight, or loose your muscle because you don’t fit Mitch’s idea of ‘hot’ and then you need to get down on all fours and have photos taken of you. I you stand up against Mitch you are cut from the team.
Josh, he didn’t just say these things to me, it was to every girl even those who previously played football and showed incredible talent! And everyone was struggling to perfect these drills.
Mary thank you for speaking about gridiron in Australia after Thursday night Im really interested in the game and would love to look into real teams in Australia that actually wear a proper uniform! but I ask you why would you leave that for the LFL it does absolutely no justice to the beautiful sport of gridiron! You will not be respected as a football player but rather looked at as a nice piece of arse! please listen to the Cleveland sports 360 interviews with ex LFL players, they are all leaving the league! It’s is an exploitation you will not be payed and will not be covered for injuries Mitch does not care about women! you will be degraded if you join the LFL. Please make a stand against the LFL if you truly believe on women being respected in sport. The LFL does not do this! The men watching do not care about how well you can play they are too busy trying to get a sneaky photo of your arse or tits.
lingerie is not part of sport! It belongs under your clothing and in the privacy of your bedroom and that’s where it should stay! When has lingerie and football ever been used in the same sentence before LFL came about? it has no place in the sporting world and shows we really have lowered out standards it’s embarrassing that sport has gone in this direction.
http://collectiveshout.org/ex-lingerie-football-league-players-speak-out/
There will also be a new one up today on the cleveland sports 360 website that myself and Melinda Leszewski were apart of.
let me know if you still want to join the LFL after hearing this??
Well done Tal Stone! You are a very brave lady!
It sickens me to see people actually trying to defend this profit driven activity at the exploitation of oblivious women. These women are selling themselves short, they are athletic and talented, yet do they really need to be almost naked to gain exposure and generate revenue? Come on Australia! These girls need to wake up and realise that they are not doing womens rights or gender equality any favors! Not to mention the potential to seriously injure themselves! I have played competitive rugby union for many years and have never be verbally ABUSED by a coach, especially not at a try-out. Limited sledging throughout a game by other players is expected, yet blatent disrespect would never be tolerated, at least by the guys I play with. A team respects one another, the coach and the players!
The fact the LFL has a uniform that only comes in ONE SIZE should be enough to shut it down!
I am a fan of sports, male and female, some of our greatest athletes are female, swimmers (Libby Trickett) or triatheletes (Emma Snowsill or Emma Moffett), both sports require revealing uniforms, to enhance performance. The LFL demands a revealing uniform, not for performance, but for the PLEASURE of the onlooker!
Lets hope our young girls dont form the view that they need to take their clothes off to gain recognition in the sporting arena. Because if this “sport” continues, they will.
Surely if the girls didn’t want to play this, and weren’t getting paid, they wouldn’t? And the sport would collapse?
What am I missing here?
Abuse in sport = pretty bog standard really. I was stamped on my head once playing rugby union. Just a standard Saturday afternoon.
As for objectifying women, this sport pales into comparison versus what women’s magazines publish to their own sex…..
Well Done Tal for going through with that!! You’re very brave!!! But what a great story, to expose such a foul industry masquerading as a ‘sport’
It’s great that you’re athletic & therefore able to give it a good go, but thank God you have more value for yourself and who you are! How sad that so many of those ladies went through that, hoping to be a part of it despite all the insults, horrid behaviour, rude tactics and slimy uniforms not realising or caring now demeaning it all is, nor valuing themselves enough to deserve something more out of life.
Amy-not sure if ive misunderstood you or you misunderstood me.
I think being called a pussy is irrelevant too. Its going to happen in any sport and cant really be used to make a case against the LFL. So if you dont think that its a problem then we agree…
LFL cant be 100% about looks and 10% about football. Doesnt add up. I didnt say what the LFL people want the game to be about (it may be all about looks, i cant say), but what the majority of critics seem to want LFL to be about is women playing sport. I was at the game on Saturday night and could agree with you that it was a football themed event; football was the main thing happening but there were so many other things happening around that made it more enjoyable for sure, like the halftime tackle competition, kiss cam, player intros etc.
No im not Mitch; but i think the guy is a genius. Im a sports management student and admire the work hes done getting it from a gimmick halftime show to now an international competition.
So really i think we agree more than disagree.
Ok quick question for Tal Stone.
Did you go there with the intention of trying out then decided to approach this group to write an article for them or did they get you to go ‘undercover’ to write the article?
What is your association with the group?
Answer these first and I’ll give you my two cents worth
“I was at the game on Saturday night and could agree with you that it was a football themed event; football was the main thing happening but there were so many other things happening around that made it more enjoyable for sure, like the halftime tackle competition, kiss cam, player intros etc.”
A “football themed event” – with other things that made it more enjoyable, like “kiss cam”. I’m sorry Josh, but you’ve just demonstrated why this is NOT sport, but simply exploitation, wrapped up in the disguise of a football competition.
Tonight is the second of three NRL State of Origin matches. I’m absolutely certain it won’t be called a “Football themed event” by anyone, nor will it have “kiss cam”, men playing in jockstraps or a half time tackle competition. They will be wearing exactly the same type of clothing worn by every league player in Australia. Would the players tonight have signed a waiver against injury before they play? (allowing the NRL to not support them when injured?)
Why should the LFL require its players to wear underwear, limited protective clothing, and have a costume (there is no other word for it) in only one size. Why do they not have standard insurance, or adhere to a code of conduct? Why do they not pay their players?
Josh, you’re a sports management student apparently – well, I’m concerned. Sports management should be about integrity, organisation, honesty and sport – not “sex sells, so lets see how we can package it this time and make more money.”
Please have a much deeper think about this issue. In the end, it comes down to right or wrong, objectification or acknowledgement of worth – a female athlete should not have to be “packaged for display” in order to be worth watching in her chosen sport. There should not have to be “gimmicks” (sexual) in order to increase enjoyment. This is simply sexist propaganda at its worst.
7 hours and still no response.
What’s the story?
I was there last Thursday night and what you say occurred is a lot different to what I saw and heard. I’m more than happy for your organization to have a go at the LFL and complain about the uniform etc as that is your prerogative. Even although I strongly disagree with those thoughts we can save that argument for another day.
What I don’t like is someone telling a story that just isn’t true. It would be good to know what your motivation was in the first place. Was it because you did not make it or a more cloak and dagger scenario of exposing the league?
I am not sure how many times you have been to a trial before for a sport. Whether it be for a lingerie gridiron team or even a basketball team; you are put through the ringer to see who can handle the pressure and rigors of that particular sport. Not to mention, there are a lot of people to get through and they can’t wrap everyone up in cotton wool.
It is also a full body contact sport where the hits are hard and often so you need to be hardened up early to make sure you are the right type of person for that particular sport.
The name calling that you mentioned was very much tongue in cheek which you did not mention. The American LFL girls who were on hand to help were all pumping the girls up with fist pumps, back slapping and a bit of good humoured ribbing. It was all done with a smile on their face which you also didn’t mention. You made it sound like a slave camp.
As for ‘pancake the shit out of her’ this was all in good spirit and said more as a motivation to give its girls some incouragement as they went head to head in a drill to push a large tackling bag against each other.
Not once did you mention how Mitch Mortaza and the LFL girls continuously told you to support one another when doing the drills as those girls could be right next to you on your team in the future. This was repeated on many occasions. A fact you overlooked.
While I was in the grand stand doing a report on the trials I do remember seeing you on the field. My colleague and I picked 15 girls who were thought did enough to make it into the squad. You unfortunately were not one of them. And by the way all 15 made it into the squad.
Perhaps gridiron is not the sport for you. Live and learn and move on. Don’t go writing articles which are not correct.
Again, feel free to bag LFL as a sport but get the facts correct when telling people that weren’t there what you saw.
I think the answer to Mick’s question as to why Talitha went to trial in the first place is quite obvious. According to reports from those present she lacked serious ability and would not have made the cut anyway.
But to write with such vitriole and negativity about the whole concept of starting a women’s grid iron league here in Oz shows what her real motives were.
The Oz league has not started yet, nor have the players’ uniforms been determined (said to perhaps be more ‘sporty’ than the American ones) yet the ‘feminists/detractors’ are falling over themselves to ridicule the entire concept. One of their prime beefs is women playing in ‘underwear’ – hardly what the uniforms actually are.
How many other female athletes, who have finally broken into what were once male-dominated sports domains, have been subjected to the same negativity that Talitha and other ‘feminists’ have dished up before they met with success.
I don’t see males forcing women to play particular sports – it’s just that there are some women who are athletic enough and possess genuine skill sets that allow them to break down the ‘glass ceilings’ which existed in so many sports for so long. They’re simply exercising their perogative and freedom of choice and good luck to them for doing so. It wasn’t so long ago that this would not have been possible.
@Mick –
“Did you go there with the intention of trying out then decided to approach this group to write an article for them or did they get you to go ‘undercover’ to write the article?
What is your association with the group?”
Why is this relevant? She went, she tried out, she reported on her experience. Tal, along with every other LFL hopeful, is not accountable to you.
Well, Tal… sad you did’t get in, however when you motive was to “expose” the LFL as the abusive and sexist, then you have, exposed yourself that is.
Except your attempt at the tryouts, was obviously a naive one, I would not expect the write up to be the same. If I went to Sydney Uni, I might not be so proud.
Perhaps I am more angry at so called scholars, writing ambushing arguments with the supposed intention of freeing women from violence and exploits. As all women who do play, are 100% consential. So, I dare ask… what the hell is your point?
My point here is that your biased encounter, is full of bull.
If you truly wanted to see:
1. “how we would be treated” then ask the rest of us!!!
2. “What would be required” – well you did nothing to expose the fact that we were tested on offense drills, defense drills, Quarter back drills, and of course the coping with comments under pressure may be there, they sure tested us on that.. you missed writing on the encouragement.
3. “test the notion that this was real sport” Well, if you were to truly test the notion of the sport, you might want to know something about it. At least do some research after so when you post something in public, you don’t leave yourself totally open.
For example, this vagina shape, is actually the shape of a diamond made with your two hands as you look through it to catch the ball. You might know this, if you really wanted to play the game. Instead, you thought to broadcast your experience on the net.
Good luck with your degree, if you are studying literature, I hope you stick to the non-fiction.
🙂 love and football
Good on you Tal! Your experience is entirely consistent with what other players have complained about with the LFL. Safety comes last and the founder is abusive towards players.
You only need to listen to the stories of former players to realise that the exploitation in this league runs deep.
The Natasha Lindsey story – she’s $10000 in debt because the LFL took 5 months to give her an MRI and wouldn’t pay for her knee surgery
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fueW6HMtdkw
Kelli Leabu has a similar story about negligence of injuries
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zyV7nAxYnYo
Deborah Poles talks about how abusive the LFL founder is towards players
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQbqwoLZE9E
Aleina Mckay discusses why 20 women walked away from the LFL
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4kMkpXVH7Co
The LFL is dodgy as! I suggest anyone signing up to this league has a lawyer look at the contract before signing. Apparently there is a $5000 termination fee for quitting the team.
Common sense would indicate that the whole concept of the LFL is based on discrimination. The right ‘look’, body type, dress size- plus the advice about image and how to have sexy hair. Face it, we aren’t going to be seeing diversity in body shapes or unattractive women. Anyone who could not live up to those standards was not going to be selected. Sounds more like a beauty pageant than a sport.
Ironically, despite the degradation of women illustrated here, I pity the men that attend the games. They obviously crave beauty above all else and would never encounter such beautiful women unless they went to a strip club. Putting the tag of “sport” on it is a poor attempt to justify their lustful behaviour. The problem is this is the direction society is headed in. Every year the media is more bold in it’s “sex sells” mantra. We are fed a diet of looking at beautiful women. We come to expect it as being normal, then wonder why we are discontent with our truely “normal” women. Equally the normal women feel they never measure up. Instead of being valued as people they suddenly become objectified and always found wanting. Small wonder really given every year their is a newer, hotter model out with which these foolish men will compare them to.
Women, take heart. The road of lust many men are pursuing will end up like gravel in their mouths. Their forgo the deeper treasures of a woman’s charater and giftings all for a false promise of sexual nirvana.
Women, take heart. Not all men are so inclined and many more are realising that this apparently harmless attitude towards women leaves one with a bitter taste. A promise that never delivers.
Women take heart, the sort of men that unashamedly pursue this approach to women are not the sort of guy you’d want to be with. Thus it’s no real loss, it just helps sift the trash!
LFL is it sport or porn? those who are defending the LFL need a serious reality check! maybe you should educate yourself with content that isnt pornographic.
http://t.co/tXk7Tvjd
Congrats on a great article Talitha but I am so sorry you had to endure all that. This is not sport. As a guy I can genuinely appreciate an athletic physique on a woman but above all it is about the atheltic ability and then the beauty that comes with that. This also includes inner beauty.
This is just cheap and appeals to the feral minded.
Again this is not sport and thank you so much for going to all that trouble. What a shame, though, that your article will not be read by many of those moronic men who think that it is fun and harmless to attend such events.
Tal,
If you are “an athlete” why were you taken aback when asked to sign a waiver? Surely you’ve seen one before? Are race or sport organisers to pay every medical bill, given injury is part of any sport?
You complain about this sport not respecting its players somehow yet you clearly show them no respect yourself by refusing to engage with the players who wanted to be there for a purpose other than some kind of “gotcha” inside scoop article. This is a weak attempt to “expose” a sport, that you yourself admit hundreds of women want to play, by an inept writer. I would accuse you of holding a grudge for not getting picked but clearly your intention was never to be selected but simply to gain access to the tryout so you could point and laugh at the ladies who are simply trying to play a male sport through the only channel they are offered. As for being yelled at and signing a waiver this clearly indicates your naiveté as those are both standard practice at any under 10s rugby training on a saturday morning. Sydney uni is a good school, keep working hard and you may turn into a great writer but this was a transparent and lame attempt.